Author Topic: USMC e US Army - Outpost and Vehicles - Afghanistan and Iraq  (Read 6571 times)

Offline henry_martini

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Re: USMC e US Army - Outpost and Vehicles - Afghanistan and Iraq
« Reply #20 on: March 10, 2014, 10:24:28 »
Honestly, I do not see differences between old and new war.

The difference is that at the start of the 21st century 'people' and 'decision makers' actually can and finally should know better.

Apart from that I consider (as you will imagine) your contribution a statement, too, I find it with regard to 'craftsmanship' exceptionally well done and impressively seemless. I had a hard time noticing what was scratch built and that only a little is ready made, and that virtually everything is real and not photoshopped. If you have fun with it, go on but do not expect everybody everywhere to be as pleased as you (and as said not without any reason) are.  :)

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Offline henry_martini

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Re: USMC e US Army - Outpost and Vehicles - Afghanistan and Iraq
« Reply #21 on: March 10, 2014, 10:32:40 »
Concerning playmo-wars:
I can understand Geobra concerning WWI and WWII as those wars have a direct and rather recent link with Germany's history, it are their fathers, grandfathers and greatgreatgrandfathers that started  those wars. And people in general don't like to see diroamas filled with Wehrmacht-soldiers, Waffen-SS troopers and Nazis. Hitler himself is often considered the anti-christ, and not without good reason. So, understandable Geobra doesn't want to see any of that (in public domain).

But: what about f.e. the British Zulu War, the US Civil War, the Naopleonic Wars, the Spanish Wars in Flanders and The Netherlands, .... , the crusades and the Siege of Jerusalem, the expansion-wars of the Roman Empire, and near the start of it all the butchering by Conan and other barbarians during the Stone-Age? Those battles and wars are often depicted as well with Playmobil in dioramas, and nobody gives a cry.
Of course in "ancient" times they didn't have automatic rifles or atomic bombs, horrible weapons indeed.
But, ever seen (or imagined) how a 17th-century sailor looks after he and the deck of his ship have been wrecked by scrapnel from canonfire? Or the corps of a knight, decapitated by the sword of his opponent?
To me it is quite the same, it doesn't matter in which era the conflict took place as long as one doesn't show (to a general public) the horrors of war but just depicts the playmobil soldiers and their gear.

The reason for toy manufacturers and (most) forums to avoid certain themes is merely that these in a predictable way lead to controversies (prooved in this very thread) because and/or in which feelings of a number of people (esp. target audience (forums), customers' parents (toys) and or among those who will 'see' it (public, forums and toys)) are hurt or upset. So the avoidance of e.g. modern war is rather a matter of 'politeness' or 'respect' (if not of business alone) and has less to do with history, views on history or politics, freedom of opinion or mere amount of cruelty alone. And there is always an implicit statement, too.
Depending on further circumstances there are of course also possible serious (e.g. different legal responsibilities of forum owners and manufacturers) and other reasons. Thus 20th century and later wars are on the nono list, as well as maybe urban violence, terrorism, drug enforcement, capital punishment, even religious matters ... ACW, knights and romans are not because there will hardly anybody be claiming to be really offended or hurt. But surely they would be was there a number of complaints large or loud enough.

Basically there is no need and probably not so much demand for toys with statement that are by their nature aimed at children. And this is why all (not only german) toy brands of importance (i.e. lego, among others) do not have ww2 or modern 'counter insurgency' themes and are instead developing fairly 'balanced', non violent theme worlds or if it needs to be violent without any noticeable ideological or historical reference. I guess this was more or less true already some time before and got more important during the last years due to a greater awareness of possible issues.




@geobra: Thanks a lot! :-)

Offline Cloud Strife

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Re: USMC e US Army - Outpost and Vehicles - Afghanistan and Iraq
« Reply #22 on: March 10, 2014, 10:41:10 »
Leonardo, you have made a very succesful diorama indeed if it creates such lively yet respectful discussion as this has.  This speaks to the very recognizable and evocative detail that you have managed to pack into your pictures.

Re the purity debate, I am not a purist myself (if it's not nailed down it's fair game in my mind  :P  )  each person has different resources and different Playmo availabilty since we are all spread out all over the world so what parts might be common for some might be impossible for others to get.  Also, if Playmobil has not yet, or will never create these parts then I say it's up to you to fill in the blanks.

Re the subject matter debate, I am glad people are upset about the war.  It is an upsetting matter.  I have family over there and even he feels the same way.

Offline Limorrj

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Re: USMC e US Army - Outpost and Vehicles - Afghanistan and Iraq
« Reply #23 on: March 10, 2014, 23:25:44 »
Dear Friends,
As I said, I did not mean to hurt anyone.
Frankly, I'm quite upset with such negative repercussions.
I was very careful, just posting photos of the vehicles and soldiers of USMC and U.S. Army.
I have several customs Talibans, and have not posted any pictures of them.
I think this would be very offensive, posting a real war.
I've been police in Rio de Janeiro and here is a daily war.
I lost many friends in combat.
Just for that I will not collect any Playmobil Police?
I think it's even a way to honor them.
Anyway, As I have posted before, I respect everyone's opinion.
Friendly
Leonardo

Offline Wesley Myers

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Re: USMC e US Army - Outpost and Vehicles - Afghanistan and Iraq
« Reply #24 on: March 11, 2014, 00:01:02 »
You made a great diorama.  I like how it's scaled for PM and respect the customizations you've done.

It should not be offensive and I can't think of why or how it would be. No one is shown hurt, let alone maimed. 

As someone who once was a soldier, I stand by what you've done. 

Remember, it's not usually what people do but how they do it.

Offline Macruran

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Re: USMC e US Army - Outpost and Vehicles - Afghanistan and Iraq
« Reply #25 on: March 11, 2014, 03:45:54 »
Redbeafs and Frogs
I must have missed this theme - sounds awesome, whatever it is!
"We like things in little." - G. Stein  
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Offline Hadoque

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Re: USMC e US Army - Outpost and Vehicles - Afghanistan and Iraq
« Reply #26 on: March 11, 2014, 04:53:15 »
I must have missed this theme - sounds awesome, whatever it is!

"Redbeefs" are British soldiers and "frogs" are French soldiers, 17th-18th century. They didn't like each other very much back then and used to call each other like that.

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Offline Rasputin

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Re: USMC e US Army - Outpost and Vehicles - Afghanistan and Iraq
« Reply #27 on: March 12, 2014, 15:57:36 »
Dear Friends,

I've been police in Rio de Janeiro and here is a daily war.
I lost many friends in combat.
Just for that I will not collect any Playmobil Police?

Friendly
Leonardo

Don't you think people who we severely affected by modern war would feel the same way. people had mothers, fathers brothers, sisters killed in modern war. In you situation they we friends. Would a Rio de Janeiro custom police force posted by a customized stirr up some issues with you even if they were not actively engaged in combat? Sex is a very normal behavior yet we, or at least the majority of members do not want to see klickies engaged in such behavior, and that is about love not killing. 

The historical sets are not about just the warriors who do the killing, there is the recent medical haycart to ballence it out ;D
If you hear the sound of the bell which will tell you that Grigori has been killed, if it was your relations who have wrought my death, then no one in the family will remain alive. They will be killed by the Russian people. :prays:

Offline Wesley Myers

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Re: USMC e US Army - Outpost and Vehicles - Afghanistan and Iraq
« Reply #28 on: March 13, 2014, 03:27:04 »
Don't you think people who we severely affected by modern war would feel the same way. people had mothers, fathers brothers, sisters killed in modern war. In you situation they we friends. Would a Rio de Janeiro custom police force posted by a customized stirr up some issues with you even if they were not actively engaged in combat? Sex is a very normal behavior yet we, or at least the majority of members do not want to see klickies engaged in such behavior, and that is about love not killing. 

The historical sets are not about just the warriors who do the killing, there is the recent medical haycart to ballence it out ;D

It is interesting you bring the police figures up.  I was wondering, after reading the reactions to this diorama, what parents and children who have been traumatized by armed home invasions, muggings, etc must think of the police sets with criminals in them.

Not to mention those whose parents were police officers killed on/off duty by criminals.

What about family members of firefighters who have died in the line of duty?  Or families who have been traumatized by fires? 

Offline Macruran

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Re: USMC e US Army - Outpost and Vehicles - Afghanistan and Iraq
« Reply #29 on: March 13, 2014, 03:34:39 »
You know one thing I really love about PM is that geobra is a non-anglophone company and therefore not really subject to ango PC prejudices. Therefore they produce sets like the famous TSA checkpoint and the bankrobber set. The truth is that life is sometimes rough and not everyone's feelings are taken into account.
"We like things in little." - G. Stein  
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