PlaymoFriends
General => News => Topic started by: Klickteryx on January 05, 2017, 19:57:05
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This should be separate from the post in the Playmobil in the News thread as there will be a change to the printing on the bible that comes with this klicky.
Apparently the word END on the left side of the book is offensive so will be removed in future editions. People may want to stock up on the current version before that happens.
http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/world/2017/01/04/tiny-martin-luther-toy-triggers-claims-anti-semitism/96150612/
Why was the word “END” written so prominently, Brumlik asked. “Theologically, there can be no other reason than that the ‘Old Testament’ and its validity should be seen as ended and superseded,” he wrote in the Berlin newspaper tageszeitung.
Brumlik is a retired jewish professor and is the one who first complained about the Martin Luther set and claimed it was anti-semitic. He also had a problem with the text of the book.
After discussions among its sponsors, the Nuremberg tourist bureau announced that the word “END” would be removed from all future copies of the toy. The theologically more correct model will be available in March.
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I think they need a hobby. Another, I mean :P
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I think they need a hobby. Another, I mean :P
Silly me, I saw END and assumed it meant the end of the book, which I think it actually does but whatever. Now we know what retired professors spend their time doing, going through toys to find anything that might offend them. 8}
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Silly me, I saw END and assumed it meant the end of the book, which I think it actually does but whatever. Now we know what retired professors spend their time doing, going through toys to find anything that might offend them. 8}
Like I said. A new hobby. ::)
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*blink* ???
It's a half inch book. The words can only be made so small.
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I feel he's making a mountain out of a molehill, and I suspect that few people would interpret he wording as he has. Certainly, to say (as he apparently has according to the report) that the wording is "anti-Jewish, if not even, anti-Semitic" seems a step too far as it implies that the wording was meant purposely to offend. His comments would have been better phrased if they had suggested that the wording could be interpreted as being anti-Jewish or anti-Semitic. In older books it is common where one part ends and another starts to have a clear delineation in a different or larger print face, so the layout is not uncommon.
Having said that, with the growing tensions in the world and the rise of extremist parties and factions, I can appreciate the professor's concern, especially as he is Jewish, that the wording could be used in an anti-Jewish way, especially by extremist right wing groups wanting to influence children and young people.
Unfortunately, he has drawn their attention to the way to do this.
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Fact is, dealing with the Jewish religion in Germany still is a very substantial issue due to our special history. Fact also are Luthers (late) anti-judaic statements he'd better not given. And fact is: The wording of that Playmobil-book is taking over an inscript to be found in Wittenberg. Due to our history it's harder to us to reject an impeachment like that than it might be to other (especially non-European) nations lacking our and the European anti-jewish history.
(http://ais.badische-zeitung.de/piece/02/36/81/8f/37126543.jpg)
Fakt ist, daß der Umgang mit dem Judentum aufgrund unserer "speziellen" deutschen Geschichte bei uns ein heikles Thema ist. Fakt ist leider auch, daß v.a. die späten Schriften Luthers einige antijüdische Aussagen enthalten, die er besser nicht getätigt hätte. Und Fakt ist, daß sich der Text des Büchleins am Lutherdenkmal in Wittenberg orientiert. Auf Grund unserer spziell Deutschen aber auch der allgemein europäischen Anti-Juden-Geschichte ist es sicher für uns ein wenig komplizierter, mit so einem Vorwurf umzugehen, als es für andere, insbesondere nichteuropäische Länder der Fall sein mag.
jj:
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The PM book inscription seems to be quite a close copy of that statue, with the word ENDE capitalised in both. I don't understand why that is seen as anti-semitic. I have read that Luther expressed some definite anti-semitic sentiments in his life, but I can't see that this is one of them.
It looks to me as if Luther in the statue has a Bible open at about the middle, with the END of the Old Testament on the left and the START of the New Testament on the right. Does this imply Luther thought the Old Testament was no longer relevant? I don't think so. He spent at least 12 years translating it from Greek/Hebrew into a form of German which could be widely understood and helped the formation of the modern German language in the process.
Any historical figure is open to criticism when viewed with hindsight. Martin Luther is arguably a great figure from German History and an obvious choice for commemoration by a German Toy manufacturer.
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The wording of that Playmobil-book is taking over an inscript to be found in Wittenberg.
Thank you for that, I love to see where the design elements for historic figures come from.
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Does this imply Luther thought the Old Testament was no longer relevant? I don't think so. He spent at least 12 years translating it from Greek/Hebrew into a form of German which could be widely understood and helped the formation of the modern German language in the process.
I had a quick look on the internet in regards that so could be wrong but I think he translated the New Testament while the Old one was a collaborative effort of several people. He also translated the New one first, which makes sense as that's the one with Jesus in it. One of the reasons it took so long is that he made frequent trips to local towns to record the common language of the people in the streets and to read out passages he'd translated into German to test whether the people got the message contained within.
His attitude to the Jews seems to have been that they needed saving, that is converted to Christianity. His later antagonism towards them was a result of understanding that they would never do such a thing and he regarded a number of them as anti-Christian rather than ambivalent.
That ENDE could also mean the end of the work as the Old Testament was added last so holding the book open between the Old and the New represents the start and end of his work.
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I know some Christians do regard the Old Testament as irrelevant now that there is the New Testament, but for most the two are used in worship and study.
There is an old saying, "The New is in the Old concealed, the Old is by the New revealed", which sums up a view of the relationship between the two.
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The logic of this accusation is quite tortured. Still, it could have been worse - the book could be showing a differen text by Luther. I have a mockup of 6099 with this text but I won't be posting it because it's so offensive! (PM if interested)
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Da das AT als Tenach nach wie vor das Heilige Buch des Judentums darstellt, kann ein "Ende des AT" auch als Ende des Judentums mißverstanden werden. Und das wäre eindeutig andijüdisch, wenn nicht sogar antisemitisch. Für ihn war aber immer wichtig "was Christum treibet", also ob ein Text Jesus und seine Botschaft zum Mittelpunkt hat oder nicht - egal ob im AT oder NT.
Luther zeigte sich in seinen späten Schriften leider recht antisemitisch, und es gibt die These, daß das aus Enttäuschung heraus geschah: er konnte einfach nicht verstehen, wie jemand nicht von der Gnade allein aus Glauben überzeugt sein konnte - sei er Jude oder Katholik.
As our Old Testament still is the holy book of Jews, so an ENDE to the Old Testament could be seen as an end to that religion. And that of course would be at least anti jewish if not anti semitic as such. To Luther the point always was "was Christum treibet" (if it's about Jesus Christ) - no matter if it's an Old or a New Testament text.
He indeed turned very anti jewish in later years and it is considered that's a result of frustration. He couldn't understand how anybody could not follow the way of that amazing grace just for faith - be he a Jew or a Catholic.
jj:
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Thank you for that information, Stefan.
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Hi guys!
There's currently a report for this thread, so while we sort it out, it will be locked.
Thanks for understanding
:wave:
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Done.
One reply was required to be removed by its own author, to prevent some misunderstanding.
On the other hand, have in mind that this thread, at least IMO, is "borderline" with GUIDELINE #4, so it might be locked again if the Mod Team decides so.
4. Members come to PlaymoFriends primarily to relax, socialize, and enjoy their hobby in the company of people who share their interest. Therefore, we ask that, in general, you refrain from discussing politics, religion, or other controversial topics. Should such a topic naturally arise, we must insist that only respectful, polite comments be posted and that extra consideration is taken to avoid insulting or rude posts. Hurtful behavior will not be tolerated, for the good of all.
:wave:
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Here's the new endless version:
(http://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/ZUwAAOSwzgBY12co/s-l1600.jpg)
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>:(
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It now looks rather like both books begin at the middle.
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It now looks rather like both books begin at the middle.
Yup! They should have printed the Old Testament title upside down too!
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Some religions / religious people might now be upset it shows like they should start reading the Old Testament backwards starting at the middle of the book... ::)
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You can always add 'ENDE' at the bottom, but now they've moved the text down the page something would need to be added to the top to balance it like a picture of something perhaps. Maybe just some squiggles.
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(http://i.imgur.com/HAhe0da.png)
You have to love it where the left hand doesn't know what the right hand is doing.
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So, how do we in the US get the politically correct Luther?
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@klickteryx Die Großen gibt's meines Wissens nur in der ersten Form - the big ones only provide the old text as far as I know.
Und daß man das Alte Testament "hinten" zu lesen anfängt, ist gar nicht so abwegig: Es wurde ursprünglich auf Hebräisch verfaßt, da beginnt es - aus unserer Sicht - genau da: Hinten 8-). As the Old Testament originally was written in Hebrew it acutally IS starting right at what we'd call "the end" - so everything's fine ::)
jj:
@JLM Tried Nuremberg Tourist Office? (https://tourismus.nuernberg.de/shop/)
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So, how do we in the US get the politically correct Luther?
You might get an "alternative facts Luther" instead ;D
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:lol:
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You might get an "alternative facts Luther" instead ;D
Good one, Mon Capitain!
As our family bible cites the same: Part 1, End Of Part 1 | Part 2, End of Part 2 I just keep laughing my head of of this "PC-shit" and weep over the "state of the Nation" (Germany). And there is no Anti-Judaism or -Semitism in Germans - Just in the about 5 million Illegals we got swept over from.
:'(
Did any of You come across the 6099 "Export Version" Luther with the english/french security hints on front?
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Silly me, I saw END and assumed it meant the end of the book, which I think it actually does but whatever. Now we know what retired professors spend their time doing, going through toys to find anything that might offend them. 8}
well iam offended that playmobil don't sell figures parts, like legs and bodys. but they don't change it. why this here?